Discussion:
COVID-19 - Washing hands requirements
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Crash
2020-03-18 20:34:16 UTC
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I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.

Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.

Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.

There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.


--
Crash McBash
R***@hotmail.com
2020-03-18 22:02:50 UTC
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Post by Crash
I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.
Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.
Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.
There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.
A quick google gave:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ninashapiro/2020/03/15/soap-and-water-1o1-why-its-best-for-covid-19-and-every-day/#4790e9cc6f60
but I agree it is not well covered by our media.
Crash
2020-03-18 23:50:39 UTC
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Post by R***@hotmail.com
Post by Crash
I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.
Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.
Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.
There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ninashapiro/2020/03/15/soap-and-water-1o1-why-its-best-for-covid-19-and-every-day/#4790e9cc6f60
but I agree it is not well covered by our media.
I have seen articles like this one, and my question remains
unanswered. To quote:

"Plain old hand soap, no, not antibacterial soap (remember, this is a
virus devastating us, not a bacteria), contains molecules that are
actually called “soap molecules.”"

So there are soaps that are not effective (antibacterial soap). What
ingredient in soap contains "soap molecules"? How do I know which
soap is inappropriate to use? There are huge number of 'hand soap'
products out there.

There is never a mention of 'liquid soap' products. Is this simply an
omission or is there a generic disqualification of these products as a
COVID-19 attack weapon?


--
Crash McBash
Rich80105
2020-03-19 00:37:32 UTC
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Post by Crash
Post by R***@hotmail.com
Post by Crash
I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.
Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.
Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.
There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ninashapiro/2020/03/15/soap-and-water-1o1-why-its-best-for-covid-19-and-every-day/#4790e9cc6f60
but I agree it is not well covered by our media.
I have seen articles like this one, and my question remains
"Plain old hand soap, no, not antibacterial soap (remember, this is a
virus devastating us, not a bacteria), contains molecules that are
actually called “soap molecules.”"
So there are soaps that are not effective (antibacterial soap). What
ingredient in soap contains "soap molecules"? How do I know which
soap is inappropriate to use? There are huge number of 'hand soap'
products out there.
There is never a mention of 'liquid soap' products. Is this simply an
omission or is there a generic disqualification of these products as a
COVID-19 attack weapon?
I suspect liquid soap and varous other names cover similar products,
although the ""Hand Wash"" in my bathroom says No Soap, No Parabens No
EDTA, No Cocamide DEA, No MIT, and then gives a long list of chemical
ingredients. I have started using the cake of soap . . .

Again from Google:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/12/science-soap-kills-coronavirus-alcohol-based-disinfectants
https://www.vox.com/2020/3/18/21185262/how-soap-kills-the-coronavirus
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/deadly-viruses-are-no-match-for-plain-old-soap-heres-the-science-behind-it-2020-03-08
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/2020/03/why-soap-preferable-bleach-fight-against-coronavirus/
https://www.nbcnews.com/better/lifestyle/many-common-household-cleaning-products-can-kill-coronavirus-if-you-ncna1160271
Crash
2020-03-19 04:22:02 UTC
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Post by Rich80105
Post by Crash
Post by R***@hotmail.com
Post by Crash
I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.
Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.
Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.
There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ninashapiro/2020/03/15/soap-and-water-1o1-why-its-best-for-covid-19-and-every-day/#4790e9cc6f60
but I agree it is not well covered by our media.
I have seen articles like this one, and my question remains
"Plain old hand soap, no, not antibacterial soap (remember, this is a
virus devastating us, not a bacteria), contains molecules that are
actually called “soap molecules.”"
So there are soaps that are not effective (antibacterial soap). What
ingredient in soap contains "soap molecules"? How do I know which
soap is inappropriate to use? There are huge number of 'hand soap'
products out there.
There is never a mention of 'liquid soap' products. Is this simply an
omission or is there a generic disqualification of these products as a
COVID-19 attack weapon?
I suspect liquid soap and varous other names cover similar products,
although the ""Hand Wash"" in my bathroom says No Soap, No Parabens No
EDTA, No Cocamide DEA, No MIT, and then gives a long list of chemical
ingredients. I have started using the cake of soap . . .
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/12/science-soap-kills-coronavirus-alcohol-based-disinfectants
https://www.vox.com/2020/3/18/21185262/how-soap-kills-the-coronavirus
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/deadly-viruses-are-no-match-for-plain-old-soap-heres-the-science-behind-it-2020-03-08
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/2020/03/why-soap-preferable-bleach-fight-against-coronavirus/
https://www.nbcnews.com/better/lifestyle/many-common-household-cleaning-products-can-kill-coronavirus-if-you-ncna1160271
Again - none of those articles contain any specifics - references to
soap are all generic. You may have your suspicions about liquid soap
as do I but neither of us can ever know what particular soap or soap
substitute is effective.

I will continue to use the ample stocks I have of liquid soap in the
meantime.
--
Crash McBash
Rich80105
2020-03-19 04:50:48 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Crash
Post by Rich80105
Post by Crash
Post by R***@hotmail.com
Post by Crash
I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.
Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.
Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.
There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ninashapiro/2020/03/15/soap-and-water-1o1-why-its-best-for-covid-19-and-every-day/#4790e9cc6f60
but I agree it is not well covered by our media.
I have seen articles like this one, and my question remains
"Plain old hand soap, no, not antibacterial soap (remember, this is a
virus devastating us, not a bacteria), contains molecules that are
actually called “soap molecules.”"
So there are soaps that are not effective (antibacterial soap). What
ingredient in soap contains "soap molecules"? How do I know which
soap is inappropriate to use? There are huge number of 'hand soap'
products out there.
There is never a mention of 'liquid soap' products. Is this simply an
omission or is there a generic disqualification of these products as a
COVID-19 attack weapon?
I suspect liquid soap and varous other names cover similar products,
although the ""Hand Wash"" in my bathroom says No Soap, No Parabens No
EDTA, No Cocamide DEA, No MIT, and then gives a long list of chemical
ingredients. I have started using the cake of soap . . .
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/12/science-soap-kills-coronavirus-alcohol-based-disinfectants
https://www.vox.com/2020/3/18/21185262/how-soap-kills-the-coronavirus
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/deadly-viruses-are-no-match-for-plain-old-soap-heres-the-science-behind-it-2020-03-08
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/2020/03/why-soap-preferable-bleach-fight-against-coronavirus/
https://www.nbcnews.com/better/lifestyle/many-common-household-cleaning-products-can-kill-coronavirus-if-you-ncna1160271
Again - none of those articles contain any specifics - references to
soap are all generic. You may have your suspicions about liquid soap
as do I but neither of us can ever know what particular soap or soap
substitute is effective.
I will continue to use the ample stocks I have of liquid soap in the
meantime.
Fair enough - provided it doesn;t say ""No Soap"" on the container!

More information is coming out all the time - although not
specifically on the Soap issue, but this one seems helpful - I have
signed up to FluTracking as a result of reading it
https://sciblogs.co.nz/infectious-thoughts/2020/03/18/how-testing-for-covid-19-works/
JohnO
2020-03-19 01:10:57 UTC
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Post by Crash
I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.
Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.
Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.
There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.
--
Crash McBash
Viruses are enclosed by a fatty barrier which is best broken down by plain old fashioned soapy soap.
Gordon
2020-03-19 06:19:42 UTC
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Post by JohnO
Post by Crash
I am a little confused by the requirement to use 'soap'. I understand
that we need to wash hands with a potion that attacks the virus
structure. What I don't understand is why soap is specified, when
more precision would be to specify the ingredient(s) that achieve that
goal.
Soaps come in many forms, from Sunlight to the cosmetic soaps sold at
markets with claimed medicinal benefits. Presumably, because all are
'soap', they are all equally effective against COVID-19.
Soap it in most basic form is fat and sodium hydroxide (NaOH). My Mother
used to make soap by heating up about 2 gallons of it in the 4 gallon
kerosene tin until the water was driven out (rendered down) the off the
stove and tip in a measured amount of NaOH stir and let cool.

I am still amazed that this gives soap which washes fat off your hands. Sure
it was not refined but it was soap.

Chemically, soap is a fatty acid salt to quote from
https://www.thesprucecrafts.com/saponification-in-soap-making-517092

Lye is the NaOH or KOH

What soap is good at is one end of the molucle "grabs" the dirt and fat, the
other "grabs" the water and off it comes.

As pointed out already, the virus is stuck together by fat and the soap
breaks this apart.

Organic Diesel is a close cousin of soap, less lye is used. As we can use
several oils/fats to make the soap I guess all we need is a fatty acid salt
to give Covid-19 the breakup orders.

Now i must refresh my memory of what a fatty acid salt is. It will have a
carbon atom or so I am sure.


Plain old soap and water has done more for public health than most give it
credit for. Like the pencil is is old technology but it still works.
Post by JohnO
Post by Crash
Then there are the liquid-based hand cleaners (not to be confused with
hand sanitisers). If there are some that contain the same or similar
ingredients that are found in soap to be a virus-killer.
There has been no coverage at this level of precision that I have
seen.
--
Crash McBash
Viruses are enclosed by a fatty barrier which is best broken down by plain old fashioned soapy soap.
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