Post by Tony Post by Rich80105
On Sun, 31 Jan 2021 02:41:13 -0600, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net
Post by Tony Post by Rich80105 Post by Gordon Post by Crash Post by Rich80105
National found themselves on the wrong side of history with the Covid
response, now they are doing it again with our legal and oral
obligations regarding climate change. It was to National's credit that
they made the first commitment to action to meet our share of
international actions regarding climate change, but now their reflex
"Oppose at all costs" attitudes are getting in the way of common
sense. It is like watching Trump with Dr Fauchi - a political party
feeding its fringe dwellers rather than doing what they know is needed
for the country.
Teh ACT and Green parties are much more concerned about human rights
than National - I do not expect either of them to support this idiocy
While I do not particularly support National's climate change stance,
what is missing from all narratives on this is that even if NZ is
spectacularly successful in addressing climate change with appropriate
reductions, the forecast destruction of the planet will still happen.
It matters not what we do. What matters is that those countries that
are the largest polluters pull back on those emissions.
I would argue that *everyone* (all countries) have to do their bit as we are
all in this together.
Small countries can not be let off the hook as we then have the arguement
that if it is good enough for them it is good enough for you.
Remember NZ is a small country with more than it fair share of green house
If every country does try to reduce emissions, we can learn from each
other. Tasmania appears to be using more windpower; talk this
aftgernoon is of New Zealand following in encouraging / requiring more
electric vehicles, and phasing out household gas connections. If some
countries do not do what they can, there may be adverse consequences
in terms of trade for example - we can expect countries with high
emmissions to receive some pressure.
There are real problems with windpower, mentioned here more than once.
There are real problems with electric vehicles, als mentioned here more than
They are becoming political credos just like climate change itself.
The science is not yet clear. We should do some things that help (most of them
obvious) but not leap into electric vehicles and wind energy until we
understand the consequences.
Electric vehicles are clearly developing year by year - as indeed are
petrol and diesel driven vehicles; currently they are seen as a good
alternative by many countries around the world. They have been around
for long enough for us to understand many consequences, but what
consequences are you concerned about that would indicate that we not
plan to make greater use of electric vehicles, Tony?
I and others have mentioned this before here and more than once.
There are a number of issues that will (not might) bite us unless we find a
One of those is the massive potential for polution from discarded batteries the
size of a divan when ev car batteries need replacing. This is not yet resolved.
So regardless of how the electricity is generated there is a dsiposal or re-use
Post by Rich80105
Wind energy is simpler, and again while the machinery of generation
continues to develop, there has been considerable success elsewhere -
No - wind energy is not simple, there are many experts who are suggesting it is
not the answer - also posted here before several times.
There is only one truly renewable energy at this time and that is hydro and the
world does not have enough of it.
The phrase truly renewable is kind of silly when you think about it.
All energy has waste or damage. It is better to argue that x has these pros
and these cons while y has these pros and cons.
Hydro as you point out does not work if the lake is dry, nuclear has nasty
waste, solar has how to dispose, refurbish the panels, oil has CO2 in the
atmosphere, hydrogen is tricky to keep hold of and wants to join up with any
other atom, it does not exist in abundance as an element on the earth
surface. Electricity only exists instantly.
There is one thing that concerns me is that no one has thought through the
implications of "Lets do this!" type of policy.
Lets all go on a road trip this summer. Refulling is about 5 mins at the
petrol station. Not so for electric vehicles. Several tens of minutes. Range
between refueling is going to be less so we need charging stations closer
together. Good for small towns I guess.
Then the infra structure has to be built. A fast charger is no household 3
pin plug. It is about 50 amps at 400V. Electric welding anyone? So we need
to have a infrasture built for the peaks which sits idle the rest of the
time. The petrol station just increases it tanker delivery frequency when